Now Here's A Surprise: 'Free Energy' Company Cancels Demo
from the how-about-building-a-credibility-machine? dept
A company called Steorn's been getting lots of press this week with its claim to have developed a machine that it claims produces "free, clean and constant energy", violating the law of conservation of energy along the way. It hardly seemed newsworthy since it essentially appeared to just be the latest iteration of something cold fusion that promises something radical but constantly fails to deliver. It's hardly surprising, then, to see Steorn postpone its demonstration indefinitely, apparently because excessive heat from TV cameras caused technical problems. Steorn says it will try to find a new date for the demo over the next few weeks, but somehow we doubt the laws of physics or thermodynamics will disappear in that time.
Reader Comments (rss)
(Flattened / Threaded)
oh great
Great technology -- but what does that mean, the air conditioner has to run all the time to get that thingy 'create' some energy?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Thermodynamics...pft
The law was calculated off the watching an inefficient steam engine. It may not hold true for everything.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Sounds like Uri Gellar. =)
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Thermodynamics...pft
Note, there are 3 laws of thermodynamics and the law you're thinking of is not conservation of energy. The idea here is that energy cannot be created or destroyed. Only transformed into a different type.
The inefficiency here is that while we can turn heat energy to kinetic energy and then to electrical energy, the electrical energy we get out is not the same as the heat energy we put in.
Even if it were possible to achieve complete efficiency, current physical laws tell us that we can't get more energy out of a system than we put in.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
money laundering anyone?
perhaps it's just a creative facade behind which to sink losses??
look at the P/L sheet:
http://www.steorn.com/about/investor/
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Raymond L
don't forget that there is some energy that will be used up during the transformation process.
That is why don't get same amount of electricity as you put in heat.
when they say they have a cheaper energy its because the transformation process requires less energy, therefore you will get a better power vs energy ratio.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Variables
Wow, both politically and scientifically, there is one hell of a soup here. Do we think rich oil wellers will simply let this happen? Uh, no. If this were to happen, oil companies would fold.
As far as cold fusion, perhaps anti-matter may be looked into to explain this. I mean, as a kid, I knew space wasn't simply "empty" it still was "something". Now of course we know it's mostly anti-matter. Look at the stars, our own sun for example, how did all this happen? Almost a constant source of heat and energy. Sure it may burn out or have a lifespan of 60 mil, but hey, that's fairly nice. I believe it's very close to cold fusion. Perhaps with the testing, they are creating a hint of anti-matter which allows the same process as a star being born only on the tiniest scale. However, sustaining it would be another matter. This may be why they don't know what is going on quite yet. Like a blip on a radar, it's there and gone. Maybe anti-matter can be created, then under certain conditions, transform a state of Anti M to heat or radiation as we know it and make a nuclear cold fusion soup when these conditions permit, allowing as I explained above, a small constant heat source. Sort of like a car battery, + and - to create energy.
From what I read, there are still just theories and nothing solid. This isn't the first time the cold fusion anything has been shot down as many don't offer proper proof, however partially do to oil companies i'm sure.
My personal theory, no big bang, we were formed from comets. Why else would we be 90% water? hmmmmmmm. Now if they discover it, I said it first on Tech dirt!
Yeah it's a crazy theory but thought I'd throw it out there. I'm in a good mood, lots of coffee.... just having some fun on TD. Cheers all.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Free Energy
You guys are sceptics to the max. The laws of physics are only guildlines for the brilliant mind. As soon as somebody figures out how to create energy from nothing, we will all be free of oil. Isn't that worth fighting for?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Free Energy
You guys are sceptics to the max. The laws of physics are only guildlines for the brilliant mind. As soon as somebody figures out how to create energy from nothing, we will all be free of oil. Isn't that worth fighting for?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Free Energy
Skeptics? Hmmmm. Well I see it a different way, optimism is good, however, many optimists usually are the ones who get hit the hardest when they find out life isn't perfect, then it comes down on you like a ton of bricks.
Pessimism is the opposite, correct? So I feel skepticism keeps the balance between those who can't see anything good, those who can't see anything but good. Skepticism balances the two quite nicely else people like you would never see an ounce of truth behind anything.
Skepticism keeps order until proof. That said, I do think there are alternate resources, but don't for one minute tell me with all the government officials past and present, and all the big wigs, that they will let their black gold go so easily. No, they will find a way to market, own, tax, what have you first. So you may think skepticism but at least we don't accept everything at face value. It's called, get this...
Common sense. Yep.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Hydrogen's where it's at
I'm no geek, not even a nerd, but it really seems like you could put together a system of alternators that could start a reaction to get Hydrogen out of water and then burn the hydrogen to create more energy than was needed to produce the reaction...
I agree that cold fusion seems kind of far-fetched, but I've heard of "un-confirmed" experiments where scientists made vehicles that produced their own hydrogen from water, one of which supposedly made it from California to New York on a little under 30 galons, then after searching our favorite search engine, google, for more information about the idea, it really seems to be realistic, and would fit in with the title of the article.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Hydrogen's where it's at
You need to study the laws of Thermodynamics. Here's a layman's rendition:
1) You can't win
2) You can't break even
3) You can't get out of the game.
There's actually one more, called the 'zeroeth' law, that goes something like this: "Shit flows downhill".
--
Texas Concealed Handgun Classes
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Hydrogen's where it's at
"There's actually one more, called the 'zeroeth' law, that goes something like this: "Shit flows downhill"
Ah yes, but only because we are limited with gravity. In space, shit floats until it hits an asteroid, but since there is no sound in space it would have sounded something like...spluck! Although even that's incorrect, now they know sound waves do travel in space and the right equipment can in fact pick them up. So after so many millions of dollars, you can hear the spluck! Where am I?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Grammar, and style counts...
"the latest iteration of something cold fusion" is a markedly awkward turn of language.
Also, the sentence immediately following this one starts with almost the exact same prepositional phrase "It hardly", "It's hardly".
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
These replies are killing me
I'm sorry, but reading some of these replies is completely killing the scientific side of me. (No offense to any of you at all.)
"The law was calculated off the watching an inefficient steam engine. It may not hold true for everything."
The law was theorized watching some processes like that--but has held true in every reproducible example since it was theorized. It's widely accepted as scientific fact.
"Look at the stars, our own sun for example, how did all this happen? Almost a constant source of heat and energy. Sure it may burn out or have a lifespan of 60 mil, but hey, that's fairly nice. I believe it's very close to cold fusion."
Whaaaaaaaaaat? Sun is simply fusion where lighter elements are being combined (like hydrogen and helium) to form heavier elements (like oxygen and carbon). In this process a little bit of mass is being transformed into energy. (Yay for E=MC^2!) It is getting energy from SOMEWHERE--by converting matter into (mostly) electromagnetic waves. It's not some magic process that defies the laws of thermodynamics.
"You guys are sceptics to the max. The laws of physics are only guildlines for the brilliant mind. As soon as somebody figures out how to create energy from nothing, we will all be free of oil. Isn't that worth fighting for?"
Being skeptic about something that goes against hundreds of years of scientific knowledge is being 'sceptic to the max'?
"I'm no geek, not even a nerd, but it really seems like you could put together a system of alternators that could start a reaction to get Hydrogen out of water and then burn the hydrogen to create more energy than was needed to produce the reaction..."
In order to convert water into hydrogen and oxygen, you need the same amount of energy that you would get from burning hydrogen. (As it combines with oxygen... the reverse of the original process.) It would be absolutely pointless. (And you'd actually lose more energy in the process, as some of it would get wasted.)
""There's actually one more, called the 'zeroeth' law, that goes something like this: "Shit flows downhill"
Ah yes, but only because we are limited with gravity. "
...It is not a literal statement. Systems tend to move towards more disorder and lower energy states. IE. if you have a hot object, it'll tend to radiate this heat energy out versus getting hotter. Nothing to do with gravity--sorry if you were just being sarcastic and I misinterpeted. XD
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Hmmmmmm
I think it can be done. It is not going to be as simple and far fetched as create energy from nothing, something is going to create the energy.
Look at the law: e = mc^2.
Each atom in the universe is a mass, which means it has energy. The energy is here all around us, we are all energy, and everything in the universe was at one time energy. There was so much energy that it has mass. Energy is what makes the atom, and atom, and that is why an atom doesn't last forever, it eventually dies out, because it no longer has the energy to sustain itself... thats where half-life, and things come into play.
Now you just need to harness energy from small amounts of atoms at the time, to get all the energy we will ever need... but that is easier said than done. As we further understand the atom, maybe we will get closer to a solution.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Variables
no offense, but you don't have any idea what you're talking about.
the universe is not mostly anti-matter. i believe the term you're looking for is dark matter. anti-matter is similar to matter yet composed of anti-particles. anti-particles are corresponding pairs to our everyday particles with the same mass yet opposite charge. upon combining matter with anti-matter, both forms of matter get converted into energy. while we are presently creating anti-hydrogen at cern, it takes far more energy to make it than the energy anti-matter/matter annihilations create. if there was anti-matter floating around the universe, there'd be trouble.
now, dark matter is a completely different story. it's an explanation used to account for gravitational differences between what our present theories predict and what we actually witness. our observations imply that there is more gravitational force happening than there is visible matter to account for the observed gravitational effects, thus the concept of dark matter has surfaced.
i won't even begin to touch that big bang/comet idea of yours, it's completely nonsensical. i hate to sound like an ass, but you really have some homework to do on these physical principles you're trying to talk about.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Free Energy
if the laws of physics "guidelines for the brilliant mind", and they say that energy can be neither created nor destroyed, only transfered from one for to another, then how is the brilliant mind supposed to create energy from nothing while still following these guidelines?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Hydrogen's where it's at
"it really seems like you could put together a system of alternators that could start a reaction to get Hydrogen out of water and then burn the hydrogen to create more energy than was needed to produce the reaction..."
unfortunately, you can't.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: These replies are killing me
as much as i commend you for actually understand scientific principles and being able to apply them logically in argument, you need to work on your sense of humor.
"Ah yes, but only because we are limited with gravity. In space, shit floats until it hits an asteroid" ... is pure comedy.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Hmmmmmm
"and that is why an atom doesn't last forever, it eventually dies out, because it no longer has the energy to sustain itself... thats where half-life, and things come into play."
ummm... no? unstable isotopes of atoms certainly decay into stable isotopes, sure, but atoms don't "die out". particles may be exchanged but matter stays as matter until it is combined with anti-matter. even when an atom gets broken apart much of the energy stays as particles, which of course are the constituents of atoms. there are more fundamental components to everything than just atoms. also, just for emphasis, converting matter (mass) into energy by our presently known means (matter/anti-matter annihilations) takes far more energy than is produced. there is no getting energy from nothing.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Jeezus X...
Jeez, people, study some damned science.
Vir Mundi - You have absolutely no idea what the crap you are talking about. The law of conservation of energy is absolute. It has been proven over and over again. I'll put it this way: if it wasn't true, physics wouldn't work.
comicfan - You're a little better off, but still don't know what you're talking about. Antimatter is extremely rare in our universe. It's definitely not what's "out there". The sun is not made of it, nor was it started by antimatter.
Nor does the sun utilize cold fusion. It uses perfectly ordinary fusion, which is extremely hot. That's why the summer sun still feels so warm, despite the sun being 93 million miles away. It's a giant nuclear bomb that takes 10 billion years to finish exploding.
I have absolutely no idea what you mean in your "personal theory". It seems that you misunderstand basically everything about cosmology. The Big Bang is the event that 'started' the universe - it's when space and time began to have meaning. Our solar system is formed from a third-generation dust cloud - all of its material comes from the original intersteller hydrogen that was burned in a star, exploded outward, burned in a new star, exploded outward again, and finally formed into our Sun and planets. It is thought that comet impacts in the early Solar System are what brought us a lot of our water, but that has nothing to do with anything else you have said.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Hellow
Hello and welcome to the news, NEW is a bit part of the word News, as it tends to relate to up to date subject matter. This is OLD news, its not been getting alot of press lately its beenn getting alot of press for a long while now. The article is missing out HUGE parts of the story. Go figure.
They originally took out a $35,000 ad in a scientific magazine to call for scientists to come and test the thing to make sure.
Stupid people.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Variables :Physicsgump and Drdolittle
Well, it's certainly nice to be noticed. But even though you state that you are trying not to be an ass, you sir without a doubt, are an ass so you can rest easy.
For one, I was simply having fun conversation, nothing more. If that is against the law, so be it. However you don't make laws now do you? Anyway, we can all tag "physics" or "DR" to our names and sound like we know what we are talking about. Physicsfan, see nice ring huh? Most likely a couple of slumps with time to sit home, drink a beer and read every page on the internet, come to tech dirt and pretend to be somebody who is soooo much smarter than us poor paupers.
Why do I say this? Simply put, anti-matter is not everywhere as you state, it is found only in small portions scattered in our galaxy, as well, only very few particles are on earth through cosmic "jets" I believe is what they call them.
Also Drdolittle, there is much speculation as to how the sun or other stars begin the process to begin with, that creates such burning. Sure we know what goes on inside or that nebulas form stars, however, there is speculation to what triggers the whole motion, be it solar wind, etc...and some speculate, an unknown force. Of course since you have DR. in your title, i'm sure you know that.
But hey, once again, I'm just having fun instead of the same drab crap everyone talks about. So scientifically putting it, shove it where the sun don't shine.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: These replies are killing me
I think what some of these people are saying is...sometimes the "science" is just dogma.
There are actually theories out there that the universe would not exist if we were not here to observe it. Essentially, if we can imagine it, we can make it happen. I don't know if that is true, but instead of constantly trying to find why something can never work, why not try to find how it might work?
I have been a scientist for 30 years. The guys that find things that work (including me) are the ones that don't say "it can't" but "why can't it?". I would bank on the non-geek, non-nerd over you any day of the week.
J-
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Free energy
You want free energy? Install turbines and biogas generators in Washington DC. Given the amount of hot air and BS that the politicians generate, we should get enough power to run half the country. :-P
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Jeezus X...
Just as I told Physicsgump, it was simply a fun conversation out of the ordinary. However, you put words in my mouth, what I meant by the cold fusion was a means to kicking off a larger reaction similar to the sun, not that the sun IS cold fusion. You need to read better. As well, I mean energy output time as our sun, not that it is the sun, once again, I think you simply jumped on the gumpwagon and didn't bother to read. The only thing I did mix up was the dark matter at the beginning instead of anti-matter.
As far as my theory about comets, which you have no idea about is this...and please understand, I don't care if you agree or not...It is known that some comets can be so huge, larger than planets in our solar system, it is also known that some of our meteor showers may in fact been either trails from comets or comets that exploded millions of years ago as they got too close to the sun due to gravitational forces. What I think is this, it's probable that a very large comet may have done the same millions of years ago, perhaps larger chunks had circled the sun in constant motion, when warming due to all the ice and dirt and all sorts of living soup, created atmospheres to sustain life. I don't think the big bang theory holds true for planets, our galaxy maybe, but I doubt earth would be 90% water if we were a molten glob to begin with. Comets can spread life and have many life giving properties, like shooting grass seed over a lawn if you will. If one were to be caught forever in a gravitational pull near a star, or shards, is it that far fetched?
Once again, I don't think so but don't really care if you get it or not.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: These replies are killing me
Re: These replies are killing me
Are you sure the replies are killing you or is it your head has swelled beyond it's capacity to sustain it's structure?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: These replies are killing me
Just to note, it's "for actually understanding" not understand.
Got something against humor? Oh well, sucks for you. BTW, have they found a way to scientifically remove that stick? Must be painful.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
The snarkiness of the post + comments
I agree with Bignumone. The way the blog post and comments read, who would ever even think of trying something that had not already been done before. Very sad.
The concept of time is a good example of something that is completely made-up by humans, but accepted as fact by the establishment. There are entire books that attempt to explain this great mystery called time -- I've read a few -- and in the end, none of them mentioned what we once knew, but have forgotten.
Time is simply a tool humans use to compare one movement to another. It's not a magical, invisible 4th dimension. It doesn't exist at all -- outside of human conception.
No mystery. No genius required.
So, if something so non-existent can be twisted and ground into our psyches as a real and true thing, what else are we fooling ourselves with?
There's a difference between stating something to be a scientifically accepted law and squashing creative thought before it has had the opportunity to breathe.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
We gotta keep the petrol companies going - -
I mean - what would happen if KY jelly fell off the market. Do you think that this stuff can be made as inexpensively if it were not a by-product of other oil company products?
Maybe to Auntie it won't Matter.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
I break
I break the laws of my state... why not break the laws of physics too! I don't the the attorney general of physics will come bring me to court. His cronies may charge me with something though.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Variables :Physicsgump and Drdolittle
Most likely a couple of slumps with time to sit home, drink a beer and read every page on the internet, come to tech dirt and pretend to be somebody who is soooo much smarter than us poor paupers.
i'm a college student who's majoring in mathematics and minoring and physics. i've been on techdirt with this moniker for a while now, so it's nothing new.
Why do I say this? Simply put, anti-matter is not everywhere as you state, it is found only in small portions scattered in our galaxy, as well, only very few particles are on earth through cosmic "jets" I believe is what they call them.
nice try troll. why don't you reread your first post and see who said "Now of course we know it's mostly anti-matter". it's really sad that you can try to pull this bullshit when anyone can look up and see your original post. of course, nobody said trolls were smart; you obviously aren't judging from the drivel spewing forth from yourself.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: These replies are killing me
wow, you really are a troll. so how does it feel to live such a sad existence in your mom's basement?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: These replies are killing me
Are you sure the replies are killing you or is it your head has swelled beyond it's capacity to sustain it's structure?
it's "its" not "it's". "it's" is a contraction of it is. "its" is a possessive pronoun.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Jeezus X...
I don't think the big bang theory holds true for planets, our galaxy maybe, but I doubt earth would be 90% water if we were a molten glob to begin with.
you do know that the big bang is a cosmological theory for the beginning of the universe, correct? it is not directly responsible itself for the creation of stars, planets, galaxies, etc. it is only indirectly responsible in that it is believed to be the start of the expansion of the universe. your idea on comets (even though it is completely nonsensical and has gaping logical holes) is not at odds in any way with the big bang.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: The snarkiness of the post + comments
so please, in your all knowing brilliance, explain how time itself (and not simply just the units of measure of time) does not exist. if times doesn't exist then length, width, and depth don't actually exist which means space doesn't exist. if space doesn't exist then you don't exist, nor does anything else. so, let me rephrase my request: in your all knowing brilliance, please, explain how existence doesn't exist.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: These replies are killing me
No, it's the complete disregard for scientific logic in most of these comments. You guys are bashing me for trying to correct misconceptions, which is completely immature. I stated most of my criticisms fairly politely trying to make actual logical points, and the best response you can come up with is you claiming my "head has swelled beyond it's capacity"?
Well PhysicsGuy (and partially Xanthir, FCD), looks like we're alone with our clearly absurd logic and points. *rolls eyes*
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Jeezus X...
Yes and obviously it's not the only thing with a gaping hole.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Re: Variables :Physicsgump and Drdolit
And if you read my other reply to someone above, I corrected this...
"The only thing I did mix up was the dark matter at the beginning instead of anti-matter."
Which you did bring up. So that was an honest typo, so nice try yourself ASS. BTW you had a typo as well so I guess that makes us even huh? LOL, once again, nice try. At least i'm not hounding everyone for their thoughts and ideas or think myself better for it. So physics may change, you sir, will always be an ass.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Re: These replies are killing me
Much better than being an ASS I admit. I can always crawl out of a basement, you will still be an ass.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: These replies are killing me
Bashing you? Who said all these statements were "killing" you? I love how you throw in comments and expect others to sit by and say, "oh, what a lovely comment." Get over it, if you can't take it , don't dish it out. Those aren't physics laws, just life.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Variables
What made the commets?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Variables
What a maroon.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: These replies are killing me
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Reality
"I reject your reality and substitute my own!"
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Time
Why then, does a clock on the top floor of a skyscraper run slower than a clock in the basement of said skyscraper?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Time
because the maintenance guy sucks
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Seriously????
5 seconds of research lead to this - Dont know how factual this page is but i think I would trust it a bit more than people talking about make believe fairy tales. If they really wanted to sell this then they could call in a few people from the most likely customers under NDA and sell the tech before giving some crack job 'Public Display'. Think i will go buy my snake oil elsewhere.
http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2006/03/26/story12884.asp
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Technical difficulties...
The "technical difficulties" had nothing to do with the heat of the camera light, and everything to do with the presence of observers (and cameras).
Saturday concealed handgun license classes in Plano, TX
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Cold Fusion...The Phenomonon Archives...
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2229511748333360205&q=heavy+watergate&total=16&s tart=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Free energy
What do you mean by "free"? Have you ever bid on a politician? They don't come cheap these days!
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Time
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: The snarkiness of the post + comments
PhysicsGuy: "explain how existence doesn't exist."
What exactly does it mean to exist? And how does time fit that bill?
I said nothing about dimension of form. How is it that you cannot have dimension of form without some invisible thing called "time" that somehow exists?
Is there truly a "past" outside of our memories? Nope. Furthermore, aren't all of our memories different? No two memories of any one event are identical, so can we ever have "time travel" into the past? Nope. What about the "future"? Seems to be the ever-evolving progression of infinite movement. All things are in motion, always. There is no time. 8:30pm is the name given to the predicted location of certain objects during the progression of their movements -- and from our collectively agreed-upon perspective. That's not something that "exists".
Back to the original blog post regarding Steorn, it appears that they should simply stop using the term "free energy", since even if we can't see it or detect it, what gets generated is coming from something, somehow. They need a new descriptive term and some online demonstrations to gain any credibility.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Time
Because motion is affected by gravity or lack thereof. You're still just comparing the motion of objects, not measuring some enigmatic 4th dimension.
Now, let's figure-out what gravity REALLY is...
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Thermodynamics...pft
Assuming that we are talking about a closed system.
Look up zero point energy.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Variables :Paul
"what made the commets?"
Very simple, yet not known. If you read up, many scientists believe they were left over from the formation of our solar system some 4 billion years ago. Some obviously still orbit our sun and in our solar system the largest is as big as our moon. They believe these comets and asteroids are "left over" from the birth of the solar system. There were other theories on collisions of much larger comets that formed our planets. All I'm saying is that I don't think it was a collision, I think these much larger orbiting comets after 4 billion years,had simply orbited closer to the sun or the sun had a higher gravity at the time leaving larger objects to orbit constantly. I mean a comet is a ball of dirt and ice, what is Earth? Of course the spinning and gravity etc...would eventually heat up the core as gravity pulls to the center.
I don't feel it's all that far fetched, and I'm sorry but at least I'm not pretending to be a physicist here, "not saying you are" simply giving my opinion. As I said, I was simply having some fun and even stated that. It's not my fault others get their kicks from "assuming" their intelligence is so great, no one else can make a statement. Once again, not directed at you.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Variables
Anonymous Coward, after seeing your comments around tech dirt, I've seen more people call you a bonehead among many other things, there are reasons for this. All I did was give an opinion in good fun and got this crap, you, you are ignorant all the time and always take the sides of those who are ignorant. Doesn't say much for you.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
sad state of science education
How utterly pathetic that most of the posts here seem to reflect the science education of a 6th grader. Those who actually do know a thing or two about science, and call the ignoramii out on it, are derided and made fun of.
The beginning of previous Dark Ages have often been marked by a decrease in the quality of general education, along with a rise in beliefs in pseudoscience, superstitions, religions, and other things completely ungrounded in reality. Rational thought not only falls in the general population but is frequently attacked by those whose beliefs do not hold up to logic and evidence.
The lack of science education displayed in these posts, especially on a "tech" site, is cause for alarm. Science is not a belief system, one alternative among many, but rather a TOOL for not only learning about our world, but also for verifying what we learn. The lack of understanding of what science is really all about is at the heart of our society's ambivalence toward and lack of trust in science. I only hope that it will not also be at the heart of our society's eventual slide into a next Dark Age.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: The snarkiness of the post + comments
i'll suggest the book "relativity, the general and special theory" so that you can understand the relationship between space (or form as you term it) and time, and why they're interrelated, the more you are in space the less you are in time or vice versa. you seem to be confusing labels that we give to things such as the past and future with time itself.
"All things are in motion, always."
and without time, there could be no motion. just as without motion, there is no time. things existing in 3 spatial dimensions require time for them to travel through any kind of place coordinate system.
if there is no time, there is no ability to travel along a 3 dimensional coordinate system because traveling implies changing coordinates. if i start at the top of a set of stairs and travel down it, i've moved through space. if there wasn't such a thing as time then that means i would exist in both places simultaneously. if i exist in both places simultaneously, can you say that both places, even though they appear separate are separate? if they aren't really separate places then that means every potential place anything could position itself in is essentially all the same place, therefore there is no actually spatial dimensions.
further, another problem that manifests without time is that if someone started at the bottom of the stairs exactly where i was going to and traveled to the top where i started, without time they would also be in both places simultaneously, but more importantly we'd both be occupying the same position in space. in fact, using what i stated above, everything would have to exist in the same place simultaneously. unfortunately, it's impossible for two things to exist in the same place in space simultaneously. that should be obvious, you can't take an apple and push it into the inside of a watermelon without displacing the material of the watermelon, the two things can't be in the exact same place simultaneously.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Time
"Because motion is affected by gravity or lack thereof. You're still just comparing the motion of objects, not measuring some enigmatic 4th dimension."
no, time is affected by rate of travel. he means two identical clocks. you're not comparing just motion, but rate of motion. but if you have two clocks whose motion is at a constant rate and put one in a faster moving frame of reference then that constant rate is no longer constant from a person observing them in a separate frame of reference. so basic question, if time doesn't exist, then how come when two people start driving from the same place to the same place, and one goes 50mph and the other goes 70mph that the one going 50mph doesn't arrive exactly when the one going 70mph does? if time didn't exist, you wouldn't even have to go 1mph to get to the same place exactly when a person going 100mph would. rate of travel in a car would be completely unnecessary.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Hydrogen's where it's at
Man, all these people with all their "Scientific Facts" of why you can't get more energy out of hydrogen than it takes to create the Hydrogen, especially liked the one with the modified laws of thermodynamics, and shit flowing down hill.
You guys are great, but you got to learn to think outside the box, the world really isn't flat, nor does it rest on the back of a turtle, with "turtles all the way down".
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Well, let me tell you why this keeps happening
There are some quite fascinating things in physics. Zero point energy, superconduction, superfluids, quantum effects, magnets & magnetic fields, ambient energy, virtual particles, absolute vacuum, relativity, strings theory....
They are fascinating since they're opening our eyes about how the universe works, and because some of them look totally unusual and are still not very well understood.
Well, just many folks grasp for the "not well understood" aspect and swear there should be free energy in there somewhere. That's basically their entire argument. Magnets for example appear to be doing work. The problem is, they do no more work than gravity does. And you can not extract more work from magnet than you can from gravity fields (which is: nothing at all).
The sole reason itself people keep assembling magnets in weird configurations in attempt to get free energy, and failing, and keep doing it, means the folks participating in such activites haven't learned a lot about their predecessors.
Even if free energy existed SOMEHOW, it would probably be a lot harder to harness, and require quite a lot more sophisticated device.
All simple solutions have been tried. We're past that. Steorn have just seen something many previous "free energy" companies have seen, and mistook it for free energy. They have no rational explanation for what they saw, but opted for the optimistic one: free energy!
We gotta feel sorry for them, since many have fallen in this trap, and maybe many more will fall. It's just a sad story, nothing more.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: sad state of science education
"How utterly pathetic that most of the posts here seem to reflect the science education of a 6th grader. Those who actually do know a thing or two about science, and call the ignoramii out on it, are derided and made fun of......"
You took the words right out of my mouth!
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Variables
You are a moron. Did you vote for Bush twice? You know nothing of cosmology or physics. 'Space' is not full of anti-matter. It's quite full of non-baryonic dark matter, which has nothing at all to do with anti-matter.
Oh and our sun is approximately 4.6 billion years old and should stay in it's main sequence burning it's remaining hydrogen mass for at least another 5 billion years.
Finally, the gravity induced pressure causing the sun's core to sustain nuclear fusion is in NO way similar to the unproven theory of cold fusion...
Sigh... this is what public education produces.. Go back to watching tv to see whats going on with Paris Hilton and stop guessing about the world around you that you are not equipped to understand.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Science
"Oh and our sun is approximately 4.6 billion years old and should stay in it's main sequence burning it's remaining hydrogen mass for at least another 5 billion years."
Shit, I better start selling all my real estate and move elsewhere. I just hope no one else is in on this.
"How utterly pathetic that most of the posts here seem to reflect the science education of a 6th grader. Those who actually do know a thing or two about science, and call the ignoramii out on it, are derided and made fun of......"
Just ponder this: ignorant or not, doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is Steorn produce excellent entertainment for lonely geeks reading websites, and that's, in my eye, commendable.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Variables
Bill, this is what happens when someone doesn't know how to read as you have shown. I had already admitted a typo meaning "dark matter" but perhaps the non-godly side did in fact make a human error when I also had anti-matter on the brain. As well, I had also explained what I meant about cold fusion. If you didn't read through the posts that's not my fault. No, you insist on jumping on the band wagon of false justice to attack me. As well, I was simply ONCE AGAIN engaging in fun conversation, nothing serious so unless you think some numb nut like you is going to solve all the physics issues and everyone else should be stifled stick it up your ass, perhaps physics can help you figure out how. It wasn't like I expected anything out of it or slammed anyone for their stinking posts, all you assholes do is read something and post it like you actually made it up yourselves, that is TRULY pathetic. At least I don't falsely claim some godly knowledge of the universe.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Variables
Ad hominem attacks are the hallmark of the simple mind of the loser in any intellectual contest. My case is made and rested by your every word in response.
Please turn off your computer and throw it out the window... for your own sake.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Variables
You truly are a dimwit aren't you? You indicate that you have read comments from Anonymous Coward 'around tech dirt' and you don't know that the moniker "Anonymous Coward" is stuck on a post when the poster fails to put in anything for the name?
Since my point is probably too complicated for you to ponder out, let me just state it plainly: There is not one person named Anonymous Coward who is spending nearly 24 hours a day replying to nearly every tech dirt article. Its hundreds, nay thousands of people WHO ARE NOT ENTERING THEIR NAME when posting!
You must be one hell of an embarressment to whatever spawned you...
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
okay, that's it ...
I've had enough ... I'm going to let the cat out of the box now ... maybe ...
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Jeezus X...
Comicfan the Simple said: "As far as my theory about comets, which you have no idea about is this...and please understand, I don't care if you agree or not...It is known that some comets can be so huge, larger than planets in our solar system..."
Really? Who told you that? The voices you hear when you put on or take off your tin-foil hat?
Care to provide the link to the URL of a respected and known scientific journal that explains a comet bigger than any one of the planets in our solar system?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Hydrogen's where it's at
you're going to to compare a fundamental principle of science to the world being flat? amazing, truly amazing.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Disadvantages.
Comicfan:
I get the impression that English is not your first language. It would also seem that your knowledge of cosmology, and physics in general, is, at best, about the level of a first year highschool student.
These two limitations will inevitably place you at a disadvantage when publicly arguing science with those who obviously possess superior knowledge. I suggest that you will provide yourself with less angst and embarrassment by simply accepting this and avoiding the pointless ad hominem attacks.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Disadvantages.
Once again, you may shove it as well.
I don't give a rat's ass what YOU think. As I said, I was simply TRYING to have an unimportant conversation for FUN not for your damn amusement or anyone else's for that matter.
You are simply a pompous jackass. There is no embarrassment on my part, feel sorry for yourself, I will defend myself as I did nothing wrong but try to have a non serious conversation.
If all you that complain are so damn smart, why are you wasting your time on tech dirt? Why? Because, you can PRETEND to be someone you're not, it's laughable, once again for all I know, you are some zit faced punk sitting behind your PC picking your nose so you don't intimidate me nor will I stop defending myself nor will I NOT speak simply because assholes like you want me to. What's the matter? I didn't reply to your first cut down? Feel left out? Unnoticed? What's your point?
Lastly , I don't have to meet your or anyone else's criteria to make any damn statement I choose. It takes quite some attitude to think you can tell others what to do, please, save yourself the trouble and time wasting bits, I won't stifle my ideas for you.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Re: Variables
Once again I really don't care what you think. Yes, I knew that jackass. However, AC makes many same remarks in the same ways, so I'm fairly sure it's the same person on many, not all, which is probably WHY they won't stick to a name, but hey, you are soooo smart, thought you could figure that out, either way, it tackles the AC who makes ignorant comments regardless.
See now I think you are a pompous ass, you tell me WHO you think YOU are telling me what to do or to assume you know anything about me? Why, because I was just engaging in some non essential conversation whether right or wrong? That's what this whole mess is about isn't it? Because I had statement that I even said was JUST HAVING FUN WITH and got attacked? You ass, I defended myself from those who took it too serious and think they are some genius. You want to join them in some false bravado, that's fine. I will not waste time answering to you or any other ass that attacks for the sake of it. Go back to mommy, suckle a bit and come back when you grow up.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Jeezus X...
"It is known that some comets can be so huge, larger than planets in our solar system..."
I can confirm this: yesterday I was monitoring several comets passing by, using my Optic Cabinet 900 play kit. It looked larger than any *star* in the sky.
But on the other hand, stars are so tiny, you never know. In fact, I wonder why the stars aren't attracted by Sun's gravity and fall into it.
Something for the science to discover in the decades ahead.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Re: Variables
Nope, simply put, I like to get to the point and say what I mean. No need to be intellectual here, words don't change a meaning, just sugarcoats it. If I was writing a paper, yes, however, I'm replying to a jackass obviously, so no, no need for intellect here. As stated previously in reply to your other asinine comment, don't bother wasting bits, you aren't worth my time.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Fun with a stick.
This is MUCH more fun that poking an ant nest with a stick.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Variables
comicfan, please don't freak out and go on the defensive, it looks odd. Just maybe try to talk about stuff you know better next time (like.. comics?), because despite your honest intention to have a fun conversation, we weren't laughing *with* you, if you know what I mean...
At the same time I don't like seeing this thread spin into personal attacks between the posters. Why attack each other when we've plenty of material to attack poor Steorn here. Let's laugh at them, point your fingers! Hahaha...
Yea anyway, that got older few days ago...
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
"At the same time I don't like seeing this thread spin into personal attacks between the posters. Why attack each other when we've plenty of material to attack poor Steorn here. Let's laugh at them, point your fingers! Hahaha..."
Yes, quite so, hardly fair engaging in a battle of wits with the unarmed.