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AMC And IMAX Engaging In Deception? Calling Non-IMAX Films IMAX (And Charging More)
from the how-to-destroy-a-brand... dept
We've been big supporters of the idea that Hollywood and the movie theaters should be investing more in providing experiences like super large screen IMAX theaters, because that enhances the movie-going experience well beyond what can be replicated with a home theater today. And, indeed, we're starting to see some of that. However, it appears that some theaters and perhaps IMAX itself, have gotten the wrong message out of all of this. Via Digg, we're alerted to someone complaining that he drove out of his way and paid an extra $5 at an AMC theater in order to see the new Star Trek movie in IMAX. Except... he discovered it wasn't actually the IMAX that we all think about when we hear the word. A little investigating turned up the news that IMAX and some theaters have started marketing IMAX's new digital theater projection system as an IMAX-branded experience, despite it being nothing like what most people think of when they hear the word IMAX. It's difficult to see how that's not a deceptive and unfair business practice by IMAX and AMC -- especially when they're charging an extra $5 for it.
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how do you tell?
Jeez...I thought iMax was iMax, but I guess not. I always thought iMax was supposed to be the biggest and best available, but I guess it's not
How in the world are you supposed to be able to tell the fake from the real thing? I wanted to go see it in iMax, but now how do I know if that's what you get?
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The purpose of trademark is to protect consumers from confusion, except when the confusion is intentionally caused by the trademark holder... then it's OK, apparently.
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I'd be pissed
but what could I do?
AMC did market an IMAX system as IMAX. They didn't lie or cheat me out of my money. They used as assumption of mine to get an extra $5 from me.
But remember the saying "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me" So just never go to AMC again.
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I paid the $5.00
So my daughter says "let's see Star Trek in iMax over at the AMC". So we pay the extra $5.00 per ticket, and Fandango took $2.00 fee instead of $1.00 per ticket.
Guess what? It was the exact same theatre it had been before the "upgrade" to iMax, except the screen was slightly curved. Oh, and perhaps just a few feet larger in each direction. Maybe it was louder too, ha ha.
As "TheStupidOne" said, "fool me once..." I won't be attending any iMax show at AMC ever again.
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Jerks
Well, I was really really looking forward to seeing the second Transformers movie in IMAX come June.
Now there is a very good chance that I will just see it regularly.
Why pay the extra 6 dollars when I can't even be guaranteed to have it be super much better.
If IMAX doesn't care to keep IMAX meaning super freaking awesome larger in all aspects, than I can't trust them.
If you will excuse me, I must inform all of my friends about this deception considering I am many a person's technical liason (sad I know ;) )
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Here's how you know if its a real IMAX or fake IMAX
a person has mapped out all the fake and real imaxes on google maps. So you know when you go where you are going. its not complete though..
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&ll=36.210347,-86.68539& spn=0.043144,0.077248&t=h&z=14&msid=113621990356540393221.000469b6c5915161c3667&iwlo c=000469b6d72410c230bbd
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Pre-movie branding
I saw Star Trek on the IMAX screen at the Seattle Science Center. Though I was smart enough to realize before-hand that this was really just a large screen presentation of the film and not really in IMAX format, the theater did run a big IMAX promo before the movie talking about IMAX's features and how great they are. It ended by telling the audience to get ready for the IMAX experience - something that probably further supported people's belief that this movie was going to be in the IMAX format.
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Brand = trust
A Brand is the trust that is built up and the expectations. Clearly the IMAX brand has been ruined. It's done now. There is nothing IMAX can do to save it. The reality is that consumers now know the lie: "IMAX ultimate movie experience". It now means you simply pay more. IMAX = more expensive.
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real-thing(?)
I really DID see the IMAX version at dole cannery in Honolulu.
But I only know it's real because I've been to the fake/poorly presented ones in the past.
Kind of proving a negative, I know, but otherwise I don't know how else you really could tell the difference. Sounds like AMC and IMAX are counting on that; thus heralding back to people simply believing in a brand simply because it IS said brand, and not actually doing their research.
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Hey, this guy, the guy who'
s complaining, he's semi-famous
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Re:
Of all the threads to troll....
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This is going to turn out to be a really expensive $5 that AMC and IMAX saved by not giving the guy a refund.
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REALLY??
"Kind of proving a negative, I know, but otherwise I don't know how else you really could tell the difference. Sounds like AMC and IMAX are counting on that; thus heralding back to people simply believing in a brand simply because it IS said brand, and not actually doing their research."
I get your point, but really...."I dont know how else you could really tell the difference?"
REALLY?
You mean, a screen that is so large its larger than your ENTIRE RANGE OF VISION isnt sufficient "difference" to tell IMAX apart from regular movies??
I think IMAX has enough market awareness with most people that they know it means A REALLY REALLY BIG SCREEN, not a somewhat-larger-but-not-really-impressively sized screen.
IMAX has been around for 20 years now, and is in every major amusement park, its pretty well known what they are. There shouldnt be any "confusion" among the masses about its nature.
This is just pure, naked, corporate greed on the part of AMC (and IMAX if they truly sponsored this "imax experience" on small screens).
Greed ruins all.
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Not Just AMC
AMC isn't the only theater company that is taking part in this deception. ALL the major theater companies are doing this. Regal Cinemas just opened a brand new theater near me with fake "IMAX" screens.
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Real IMAX
A few years back, I got to see The Return of the King on the IMAX screen at the Indiana State Museum - it was not an IMAX film and it was just being blown up and shown on the IMAX screen and it was still amazing! When the screen is bigger than your field of vision (and the seats are raked at such an angle that there is no one in front of you blocking your view) you really can get lost in the movie and it's the next best thing to being there. If I pay extra to see a movie in IMAX it had better look just as good as ROTK did or I'll be asking for my money back, too.
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There's a real IMAX theatre by me with the really huge squarish screen that costs like $15/ticket. Gonna go see Star Trek tonight on it. I'd be really pissed if this false advertisement tricked me though. I'm sure they were just trying to pull one over on the people who have never seen a real imax screen, because they wouldn't know the difference anyway. Also, part of the IMAX experience is having the speakers behind the screen so voices can come from that exact location on the screen. I wonder if they did at least that on these fake ones?
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Re: Here's how you know if its a real IMAX or fake IMAX
That's not "all" of them.
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Re: Re: Here's how you know if its a real IMAX or fake IMAX
Hence the whole "its not complete though.." right before the link. dumbass.
How about reading, or instead of complaining try to add some useful information since (upon opening the link in question) it's obviously taking user submitted information to complete their map.
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Fake Imax
The thing that makes this so much sadder is someone in management probably got a big bonus for this stupid idea
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Re: REALLY??
The guys point is that how could you tell the difference if you've never been in one of the original IMAX theaters, not how could you tell the difference if you've physically seen both.
You'd be surprised what the public actually knows about various brands. Hell, just yesterday I found out that the average person actually has no clue what a Zune is.
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Re: Fake Imax
I think you've missed the point --- this was not likely about a gimmick or "let's trick the customers", but IMAX developing digital projection (as opposed to the standard what most of us think of IMAX with the gigantor reels for the films as well as the huge screen - thankfully the sound experience maintains the qualities that we expect in an IMAX experience) and expanding into that market.
While yes, it would be lovely if the theaters would be promoting things properly (i.e. in the LF Examiner article linked, it mentioned that originally various operators had wanted to promote as "IMAX digital"), I can understand the concerns of the head of the corporation being concerned that it would cause public reaction to older (proper)IMAX as being out of date or not being as willing to pay the premium ticket price for the traditional IMAX experience, due to not having the "digital" appended to it.
However, I think what the CEO failed to realize is that for any of us who have watched multiple films on IMAX, the newer digital projection system setups do not give us a "wow" factor. (I spent most of my formative years in a city with a science center and an IMAX - most of the films were educational, but I did get to see the Fantasia release in glorious overwhelming size and sound)
Part of what has confused me in the past (2003ish), is that some theaters with traditional IMAX setups have variance in the screen size - i.e. the one at Ontario Place in Toronto is smaller than the screen at Science North in Sudbury.
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It seems worth pointing out here.
that, unlike the Dark Night, *none* of this film was show with IMAX cameras on 15/70 horizontal transport film... so even if you go to am "IMAX Classic" (amusing, that "Classic" still means "the old thing which was still worth it", isn't it; Coke must be almost as embarassed), you're *still* not "really" getting IMAX; you're getting 6-perf 35 scope blown up to IMAX.
And cinema buffs who've seen it already will be hinted to that it wasn't even shot with spherical lenses by the elliptical bokeh in a couple of deep focus pulls.
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Re: It seems worth pointing out here.
Aw, jeebus. "Shot"
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Not falling for that again
Saw Watchmen on an "IMAX" screen. It was slightly larger than the regular 35mm screens. It's not even up to 70mm standards. (And yeah, screen size isn't the totality of it, but it is rather the point of it.)
Way to burn a brand. Now I'm suspicious of anything that brands itself 'IMAX.'
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YES
I've been to a number of IMAXs, and the one in Columbia MD is NOT a large screen. It's like a regular sized screen with the volume turned up. Consumers equate IMAX with huge size and massive sound.
I've been to the one at the Smithsonian, the one at the south Florida science museum (in Fort Lauderdale), and the one in the science museum in Barcelona. The one in Barcelona is BY FAR the largest (when you look at the center, it encompasses your entire vision). I thought the one in Columbia was a sham, and I would not be surprised if they get sued.
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I did the same thing
Paid more money, drove 35 miles to see the Trek film on IMAX, only to find a screen not much larger then normal.
Needless to say I was a bit annoyed (still enjoyed the film though). However, I am probably not going to think about AMC theaters again, other options here for me and I will use them before AMC in the future.
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Re: how do you tell?
you tell by the fucking 80 foot screen the movie is on.
if you don't understand that after reading this article, and seeing the image they posted then you shouldn't be able to go out in public anyway.
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AMC and IMAX Suck
Yes, they such because they are trying to make people pay $5 more for a digital projector, by sucking people into what they thought was a large screen 70mm experience. The only experience was being ripped off.
I will avoid both AMC and IMAX because I can't tell when they are lying about what their showing.
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just sit closer
I think it's kind of funny that people complain bitterly if they have to sit in the front two rows of a theater, but then the same people pay $6 extra so they can sit in the IMAX equivalent of the front two rows of a theater.
Maybe my kids have the right idea - just stand ten inches from the TV set and save ALL the cost of going to the AMC.
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I think Aziz is looking for some media attention. Perhaps Parks and Recreation isn't pulling enough numbers to be renewed.
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better than IMAX hidden in Tampa
MOSIMAX- Museum Of Science & Industry IMAX
Something they will never showcase in Tampa,FL is the MOSI or the IMAX there. It's a dome theater that you literally lie back to watch the film. The film goes all across your plane of vision and just a shade past. They also give warning of sensory overload(I guess it happened). Now that was an experience.
We have a place called Channelside with an IMAX. It's just a little larger in the screen department. The equivalent of a 25" TV vs a 27". It was a complete rip-off. I was "once bitten" there.
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Does AMC/ whoever really claim to play Imax films?
Just wondering, I know during the previews some films have been marketed as an IMAX Experience, but I always assumed that just meant it was playing in an IMAX theater as well as any regular sized theater, such as AMC. Then again, I always knew the IMAX theaters were ginormous by comparison.
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And that...
Ladies and Gentleman, is exactly the kind of behaviour that's kept me from spending even one thin dime in a movie theater in at least the past 4-5 years.
There's gotta be a better use for that real estate, because charging people money to sit in a store front and watch a video sure isn't working.
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This story interested me - mainly as I hadn't realised imax screens were that big. I've been to a couple of imax films in the past and wondered what the big deal was, since they weren't much different from a large normal cinema screen. Turns out I haven't been to a proper imax at all!
Seems they've been pulling this stunt in the UK for a while
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Re: better than IMAX hidden in Tampa
Chicago's Museum of Science & Industry has the same thing, a large domed screen so the image seems all around you. They call it an Omnimax. I have no idea if it has anything to do with the Imax brand or not, nor am I sure if they show mainstream movies or just the education ones. I haven't been there in forever.
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Re: Real IMAX
Is the IMAX screen at the Indiana State Museum a full-size IMAX screen? I haven't seen a film there in a few years and I can't remember. I've seen a couple at the new IMAX in Noblesville and it was disappointing. My girlfriend thought it was way too loud (could be because it was just a large movie theater, nothing special) and for a friend of mine that was his first IMAX experience. He commented over and over that it didn't seem as big as he thought it would be. If the one at the ISM is a huge full-size screen, I'll start driving downtown to see IMAX.
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Regal Cinemas in Crossgates Mall in Albany NY has FAKE IMAX
I thought that something was wrong with the movie screen and experience.
The only thing IMAX about their theater was the very loud sound system.
This is just wrong!
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Re: Re: how do you tell?
Do you just enjoy berating people, or are you really that thick? He means if he sees a movie advertised as being shown in "IMAX" how can he tell from the ad, without going to the theater, if that's "real IMAX" or "fake IMAX"? I'd say you have to call the theater, but 1) that kind of defeats the purpose of online listings and 2) it can be hard to get hold of a human to ask a question at some theaters.
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Re: Re: Re: Here's how you know if its a real IMAX or fake IMAX
He was merely pointing out that you contradicted yourself. You first stated that it was a map of ALL of them.
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Re: just sit closer
Sitting in the front two rows of a regular theater would be great, if your seat were in the middle of the screen, vertically. But it's not, you're at the bottom of the screen looking up. In a real IMAX theater, you get most of your field of view filled without craning your neck.
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Re: how do you tell?
They won't change anything until they think it's going to hurt their bottom line. Please sign my petition here to tell them we're not going to put up with this crap: http://bit.ly/liemaxpetition
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Its 4X smaller for chrissakes! Can I pay 4X less???
How many of us are getting the old bait & switch by IMAX at our local movie theaters! These screens are 1/4 the size of real IMAX and they are charging full price and hoping we won't notice!
Look at this link for more info and a shocking picture of the size difference!
http://www.lfexaminer.com/20081016.htm
Did they think we wouldn't notice the screen is 4x smaller than its supposed to be??
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So for $5 more they are charging you for a up to 2048x1080 resolution digital picture on a slightly larger screen than a normal theater.
I think I'll pass. I get that for regular price. In fact for $5 more I also get: nobody under the age of 21, food, beer, wine ordered before the movie starts delivered to me in the theater, and a more private viewing experience with separated rows at double normal stadium seating.
Oh how I love privately run theaters. http://www.cinetopiatheaters.com/cinema/theaters.htm
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"The purpose of trademark is to protect consumers from confusion, except when the confusion is intentionally caused by the trademark holder... then it's OK, apparently."
It wouldn't be trademark, it would be trade dress. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trade_dress
Trademark would be something like Nike or Microsoft or something of that nature.
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Whining whining whining......
This page has been waste of my time, but my wife pointed it out to me for review....
Has anybody here ever known a ball can come in different colors and sizes and surprise, it is still called a ball.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMAX
http://www.experiencefestival.com/imax_-_technical_speci fications
BTW. I went to see the Start Trek in the Digital IMAX theater and the image + sound quality was far superior comparing to older IMAX formats.
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Re: Pre-movie branding
You may be confused as many of us are due to the mis-branding by Imax. This simply isn't an issue of format, most people are aware that Star Trek was not shot on Imax's proprietary film, that is was shot on regular 35 mm file and through their upscale conversion process, made to fit Imax screens.
What this article is about and what most people are upset about is something that you may or may not be aware of (thanks again Imax). What is happening is that in regular AMC theaters, they are claiming to show Star Trek on an Imax screen, but in reality the screens they are showing them on are only slightly larger than a traditional 35 mm screen (about a few feet more than 25 ft tall or something). Compare that to a 72 ft tall traditional Imax screen, which is probably what you saw it on being that it was at a Science Center, traditional home of Imax.
So unbeknown to you, you wouldn't be aware of the smaller screen bait-and-switch that so many other people are angry about.
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Re: real-thing(?)
If you've never been to a traditional IMax theater, the way to tell the difference is that a traditional IMax screen is 72 ft tall and these new "digital" screens are around 25-30 ft tall only. But in the end, you still pay the same price. It's pretty easy to tell if the screen is the size of a small store or a 3-story tall building.
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Re: better than IMAX hidden in Tampa
I feel I have to respond to this, because I feel the writer is giving the Channelside somewhat short shrift. I used to live in Tampa and attended several Channelside IMAX films, and the screen definitely is much larger than a standard size. I certainly wouldn't group it in the same category as the "fake IMAX" screens.
I think the problem is one of comparison: the MOSI IMAX in north Tampa is just as awe-inspiring as the writer noted. It's gargantuan. It's one of the old-school ones several major cities have in their science museums. The Channelside screen doesn't come anywhere close to the one at MOSI.
So I can see how Channelside looks unimpressive next to MOSI--hell, anything would--but I totally disagree with calling it "a complete rip-off."
Having watched Spider-Man 2 in a regular theater and again at the Channelside IMAX a few days later, I can honestly say, it was like a different film. The difference went far and above the "25 to 27" inch difference the writer noted, in my opinion.
That said, I am disgusted with what IMAX is pulling in many places with the way it is marketing its digital system. IMAX should straighten out immediately before it starts staring at a class-action suit.
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Re: Whining whining whining......
That could be the most illogical, and entirely pointless, argument ever made.
This isn't a ball. It's a branded system that has marketed itself on the notion of showing a huge image. It's very name comes from merging "image" and "maximum."
What if you bought something called a Hummer, paid the money for a Hummer, and they gave you a vehicle the size of a Toyota Yaris? Think you might whine then? Or would you say, "Um this isn't anywhere near the size I expected, but it sure runs well. I'll take it."
This isn't about quality of picture and sound. This is about honestly marketing a product.
Next time, let your wife leave the comment. Clearly she's the one with the brains.
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Re:
Little Movie, lots of blank screen.
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IMAX
I felt that the same when I went to see a movie in IMAX
Crossgates Mall. The screen size and the audio system did not
Compare to other IMAX theaters that I have been in.
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Re: I'd be pissed
It's not AMC's fault - they paid IMAX $5000 minimum for the right to advertise it as IMAX. IMAX is a brand name, NOT a screen size. I was annoyed, too, but don't blame AMC.
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Really?
You walked into a 2 story building expected a 5 story screen?
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Re: Pre-movie branding
@Dotar Sojat, The IMAX at the Seattle Science Center is the REAL IMAX. JUst check the link from post #6!
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"fake" IMAX...
People, you have to remember that when IMAX first came out, conventional movie screens were a fraction of the size they are now. The screens in today's stadium-seated theaters' largest auditoriums are not much smaller than IMAX any more...The AMC IMAX screen at the theater by me stretches from wall to wall, and from the ceiling down to maybe a couple feet from the floor, and is much larger than the 27 x 58 feet in the sketch. The main difference is that, at the AMC Imax the top row of seats is higher in contrast to the screen than at a "regular" IMAX. Maybe this difference in the seats' trajectory to the screen accounts for the more dramatic feeling some say the get at an original IMAX.
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how to find true IMAX theaters (I think)
on the IMAX website you can tell the real from the fake by clicking on "Find Your Imax Theater" on the homepage. After the search results appear, click on the individual theater. Then click on "Theater Type" (top right of the screen). If it says "Classic-design IMAX theater" it should be the real deal. If it says "multiplex design IMAX theater" its not.
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