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stories filed under: "niklas zennstrom"
Legal Issues

Legal Issues

by Mike Masnick


Filed Under:
copyright, ip, janus friis, niklas zennstrom, ownership, skype, voip



Skype Tech Licensing Soap Opera Continues: Founders Sue eBay, New Buyers For Copyright Infringement

from the someone-screwed-up-big-time dept

Over the summer, we wrote about the bizarre and protracted legal dispute concerning whether or not eBay actually had the rights to the core technology in Skype. Skype's founders, Janus Friis and Niklas Zennstrom, claim that they retained the right to the core technology in a separate company called Joltid, and that they terminated eBay's license to that technology. There's a legal battle already underway about that, but apparently that's not enough, as Joltid has now filed a separate copyright infringement lawsuit against eBay and the list of investors who recently bought out a big chunk of Skype from eBay. The thing that still amazes me is that pretty much everyone realized right away that it made no sense for eBay to buy Skype. That was a bad idea from the very beginning. But finding out that the purchase price didn't even include the core technology, and that Joltid had the ability to revoke the license, makes the purchase almost monumentally bad.

9 Comments | Leave a Comment..

 
Surprises

Surprises

by Mike Masnick


Filed Under:
ip, janus friis, niklas zennstrom, ownership, skype, voip

Companies:
ebay, fasttrack, gizmo, joltid, kazaa, skype



Skype Founders Claim eBay No Longer Has A Right To Skype's Core Tech

from the this-is-going-to-get-messy dept

As you know, eBay bought Skype for a ton of money a few years back, without having any real plan for what to do with it. There were no synergies between the two, and about the best that can be said for eBay's ownership of Skype is that they didn't kill it (though, frankly, the new UI is so bad, it makes me wonder what they were thinking) and let it continue to grow organically. Earlier this year, eBay finally announced plans to spin off Skype. Fair enough. It can probably do a lot more outside of eBay than from within. However, it turns out that there may be a bit of a legal hitch, as Skype's founders claim that eBay/Skype no longer have the legal rights to Skype's underlying technology. Apparently, the claim is that Niklas Zennstrom and Janus Friis and a separate company they ran, Joltid, only licensed the underlying technology to eBay/Skype for a limited time -- and that deal has now concluded. The two companies are scheduled to fight this out in court.

There are a few interesting asides to all of this. First, it reminds me of how Zennstrom and Friis ended up in another lawsuit a few years back, also involving questions about licensing the core underlying technology of Skype. There's a lot of background here, and not all the details are clear (at all), but that original case involved the claim that Zennstrom and Friis used the same core underlying technology that they used to build Kazaa to build Skype. Way back, Zennstrom and Friis had created two operations: Kazaa and FastTrack, which created the underlying tech used in Kazaa. However, they also licensed FastTrack to a company called Streamcast, that made a product called Morpheus that competed with Kazaa in the file sharing space. Got that?

The folks at Streamcast insist that part of their contract with FastTrack was that they had a right of first refusal on buying the underlying technology. But then, all sorts of stuff happened, with Kazaa being sold off to a group in the South Pacific, but Zennstrom and Friis supposedly retaining some core technology which (Streamcast claims) they used to build Skype. Then, once Skype sold, Streamcast claimed that the whole thing was an elaborate shell game, but in selling the Skype underlying technology, Streamcast claimed that Zennstrom and Friis violated their agreement on having a right of first refusal on purchasing the technology.

Yet, now I'm left wondering if that original claim was true. If the current claim is that Joltid still "owns" the original technology and Skype/eBay only licensed it, then the technology itself might never have actually been sold (unless, we're talking about two separate core underlying technologies... which is possible).

Still... the bigger question? How the hell did eBay make a deal and not make sure it had either purchased (entirely) the core underlying technology or had a guaranteed perpetual license that couldn't be revoked? The eBay Skype purchase was bad enough already. Could it be even more ridiculous in that eBay didn't even properly purchase the technology in question? It seems preposterous to believe that a company could screw up an acquisition that monumentally, so you have to wonder if it's actually true.

In the meantime, since there are questions about how eBay can rebuild Skype's underlying core technology without violating the many patents in the space, it makes you wonder if eBay may be forced to simply buy someone else's technology. Maybe it's time to call up the Gizmo Project (which has built a very Skype-like product) to see what they're up to these days. Though, can you imagine eBay needing to buy another company just to power Skype so it can be spun off again? Yikes!

9 Comments | Leave a Comment..

 
Failures

Failures

by Mike Masnick


Filed Under:
earnout, niklas zennstrom

Companies:
ebay, joost, skype



eBay Evaporates $1.43 Billion In Supposed Skype Synergies

from the not-quite-so-good dept

eBay made a few announcements this morning concerning Skype, and while the press seems focused on Skype founder/CEO Niklas Zennstrom leaving the company, that's hardly the interesting part of the announcement. Instead, the important news is in the fine print, concerning how much eBay is paying Skype as an earnout. Back when eBay bought Skype, there was an initial payment, and then an earnout based on how many new users and how much revenue Skype brought in. At the time, we noted that Skype really didn't have that many users and while it was a good product, we didn't see the synergies with eBay. Two years in, and it seems that this view was correct, as the supposed synergies never showed up. And, while Skype has continued to grow, the pace has certainly slowed. Back when the company was bought, at peak times there were usually around 5 to 7 million users online. These days, it seems like it's usually 8 to 10 million. That's not bad, but it's hardly astounding growth.

And, in fact, this slow growth is clearly seen in the earnout. eBay only had to pay an additional $530 million -- well short of the $1.7 billion maximum payout, clearly suggesting that Skype's growth has been a lot weaker than the company had hoped. To underscore how poorly Skype seems to be doing compared to eBay's plans, the company is also taking a $900 million impairment charge to write down the "goodwill" associated with the Skype acquisition. Ouch. That hurts. It's also leading to calls from all over about how eBay should sell off Skype, admitting defeat in an acquisition that never made sense in the first place. The funny thing is, a big part of the reason why eBay ended up paying so much for Skype in the first place, was due to a ridiculous and misleading hype frenzy (in part, based on a typo). You would think that eBay, of all companies, would recognize the buying frenzy created by an auction situation -- but apparently not. As for Zennstrom, it hadn't really seemed like he was all that engaged at Skype anyway, and the timing of his departure coincides with the launch of his new product, Joost.

13 Comments | Leave a Comment..

 
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