Yeah, if the RIAA really wants to stop people from downloading illegal mp3s, why don’t they just hire people to walk around in the internet tubes with a net and instruct them to catch any songs rolling on by.

I opted to settle my case figuring it would cost more than the settlement amount to hire a decent lawyer. Its the equivalent of paying $2 for every song you were sharing 🙁

Whilst it is comforting to know that the lack of evidence is preventing the RIAA from progressing illegitimate cases (as the majority of them are irrespective of whether the IP address is tied to an individual) is there any risk that this could lead to increased demand for IP-based surveillance through ISPs: as we are seeing with VoIP (which, incidentally, the UK police is now pressuring for

http://fishnchippapers.typepad.com/tomorrow_fish_n_chip_pape/2006/07/oh_dear_the_thi.html

the RIAA decides to sue everyone that used the wireless connection!

I am suprised nobody came up with this sooner..

lets look at history, DirectTV sued thousands of people who bought hardware that could be used in Sat signal descrambling. Well they sent out lawsuit paperwork to each person who appeared as a customer for the company they raided. Every single one of the suits (except the people who gave up to easily and settled) was dropped right away. DirectTV couldn’t prove that you actually used the equipment for stealign signals, its like charging someone with murder if they just buy a gun. Yes it can be used for that but prove that I did it. Just because my IP was seen downloading music doesn’t mean that it was me, prove it was.

I partly agree with the need to be responsible. If you invite friends over and they leech off your internet access, hence your IP add is pointed out as a culprit and all that. You really would like you were encouraging it if you know it was their intention.

In any case, there are legally downloadable material off the Internet. Until you find more legal downloads that suit your taste, just try to keep away from activities that could imply you were doing something that RIAA could sue you for.

What happened in California case is not so typical. I have never before heard of them dropping a case just because they had no evidence.

Just go to allofmp3.com and you can buy mp3’s for $.02 per mb. Its a russian site and its awesome.

Just wait – soon we will all have to log on with a personal user identity or perhaps even a thumbprint, to use the internet.

That way, they’ll be able to say that an IP address _IS_ a person.

No, just means that every computer that might have been able to download off that ISP gets searched. And even if they find all you did was visit a certain site and then deleted all files from it, you can still get jail time.

haha haha. so they check any laptop that might have been able to wirelessly log on to your connection? they’ll knock on your neighbor’s door a mile away (because its possible there was some signal funneling going on to carry the waves through the invisible tubes in the air)

bob wrote “First of all pay for your damn music and you dont have to worry about lawsuits. Second of all if you’re so stupid you dont know how to secure your network you deserve to get sued. You are responsible for that IP address as per terms of service and letting someone else use it makes you responsible. If you dont know how to use every feature of an item you buy you shouldnt buy it”

Deserve to get sued you should be a cop. SHut your COCK GARAGE BOB! and fuk paying for music its just as bad as paying for gas.. The riaa and oil companys should join forces to create a super douche team.

What is the best program to use in spoofing your MAC address. FUCK THE RIAA

Interesting comments on both sides of the issue.

Question: Do You think that the R.I.A.A. would have started this Cyber-Digital Witch Hunt trying to sniff out practitioners of transidental downloading of coveted Mp3s if Metallica-Sonny had not have stretched his A** hole over top of his head and got everyone stirred up about file-sharing?

The internet is based on file sharing. When Tim Burners-Lee came up with the idea that documents on one computer could contain links that could access documents on another computer, the internet was born! See http://endnear.com/ca472/ca472lecnotes18.html

If file sharing is illegal then by the same token, the internet is also illegal.

More like the “Land of the imprisoned and home of the weak.”

John,

The issue is about the fact that the RIAA and record labels have been unsuccessful in going after people who simply claim another user used ther connection.

If you do more careful reading you would see this has nothing to do with the statue of limitations.

Seems to be an extremely effective defense that the RIAA is afraid to test.

if you leave a knife or gun, etc. easily accessible knowing that a visitor is likely to use them in an illegal way, you become an accessory.
You really are a special form of stupid, aren’t you? It’s possible that a person could be held liable for failing to secure the weapons, but not as an accessory to murder.

In the case of an unsecured network, that’s not exactly going to equate to being the person who benefitted from the “crime” of downloading a few MP3’s. It’s impossible to assign a monetary value to each song which passed through some schmuck’s router without his knowledge, and the RIAA can’t prove that the network owner actually knew that anything illegal was going on. If they can’t make any money (and the legal fees are pretty damned high in a civil case vs. a criminal case, which the state would pay for), they aren’t going to waste time.

Another victory for fans. I don’t think i should be required to pay for a song if I download it once and I listen to it once, and delete it. I don’t think I should have to pay for a movie if I watch it only once, especially if it sucked ass.

Why does the WHOLE United Sates have to be run by rich and greedy bastards? It all trickles down to the RIAA/MPAA/BSA wants money. They make alot more suing you for the money than they would if you would have paid for it legally. Piracy isn’t costing them money-it’s making them money from lawsuits. DMCA should be burned. As far as I knew, recording or recopying of a certain document was legal as long as it was for private and/or non-profit use. Then along comes the DMCA. :- Money make-a da world go roun.

I know an IP Address doesn’t link to a certain computer. IP addresses can be spoofed, MAC Addresses can be spoofed, Referrer URLs can be spoofed, basically anything on the internet can be faked. Hard evidence- like DNA or a knife- hold up alot better in court than electronic, substantial evidence-like an IP Address.

http://forums.phoenixlabs.org/t12171-riaa-will-drop-cases-if-you-point-out-that-an-ip-address-isnt-a-person.html

That’s from a person who is involved in real copyright infringement cases. If you point out that you had a WiFi open, and you can prove you didn’t know what you were doing, i.e. it came open, and you could convince them you don’t have the computer know-how to figure out how to encrypt your wireless, which many people probably don’t, then you’ll probably get the case against you dropped. Too bad my roter came Encrypted.

If the RIAA/MPAA want to stop piracy then why don’t the just make there own uber encripted hardware and supply custom uber encripted media!

Oh this won’t work… They want the public to pay for their DRM hw and sw development…

These guys are jackasses

Re: hey by phuqtup1 oh one last thing if you use your VCR to tape a program why arent you sued for that?

As far as i know it is illegal to record off television with a VCR…. at least in australia it is lol lame

It is worth remembering that there is a difference in the burden of proof between civil and criminal cases. While in criminal cases, one has to proof guilt ‘beyond a reasonable doubt,’ civil cases only require ‘preponderance of the evidence’ (i.e. guilt is more likely than innocence). With this in mind, remember that the RIAA does not necessarily need to conclusively prove who in your family or network downloaded the music, they only need to show that it was more likely than not that you did it.

Also, there is legal precedent in both criminal and legal matters for prosecuting, in this case, every user of the network in question (supposing the number is small) if it is certain that the network is responsible but uncertain who was responsible. In my state (Texas), this precedent is often used to bust everyone in car if drugs are found and no one is willing to rat out his or her companions.

Like it or not, (and I don’t) while their tactics suck, the RIAA has a point. Artists should, under US law, be able to control and profit from the distribution of their own music. In the end, the online community and the RIAA will probably have to compromise on an iTunes-like solution.

I can hack people

I dont know what your all talking about but I.P means Important Person.

also i forgot to mention something called a mac address… this is encrypted into every NIC and they’re all unique. If the RIAA knows ur mac address then they know exactly what computer the illegally obtained information is on.

lmfao

i’ll hack your mom

I got an e-mail from mys isp. They claimed that various companies have complained about me downloading and uploading their crap. It then goes onto list all the complaints. Its not just music its TV shows, movies, video games ,etc. The companys explain that they have the right to purjur…or something. Anyways my isp is threatening to shut me off. Can anyone help me? What can I do? What do you think will happen?

True, but they can always catch wherever you downloaded the torrent from.

True it is almost impossible to completely wipe information but you can secure wipe it with as many passes as you deem required. To get the data off at this point would require millions of dollars to have it analyzed under an electron microscope so it’s hardly worth it. Secondly they have to have warrants and such to take you hard drive this would be difficult with out real proof not the lame IP address bull. Thirdly it is possible to spoof IP addresses change the MAC address so it doesn’t matter that the real one is encoded on the card because everyone sees the changed MAC and as for every MAC being unique I don’t buy it.

You spoof your MAC address (easy, freeware, insert a number) and you leech off a wifi (ideally, you get a cheapass laptop, put it in a plastic bag and let it bittorrent overnight, or all day if they’re night people)

What’s so hard about it?

And BTW it’s not a GIVEN that “artists” should have infinite control over whatever they produce. To some extent, when you put something out into public culture, it’s up for grabs. If you REALLY want to support the ARTIST, mail them unmarked cash instead of trusting the music industry to pay them fairly. And GO SEE LIVE MUSIC! Without brainjacking, you still can’t share THAT.

Yes, good idea, and they should have their subordinates walking around the city parks where radios/cds are being played and if anybody is near the radio/cd, that doesn’t own the digital sounds coming from it, they should immediately have earplugs shoved into their ears so that they do not get any free music that was not purchased by them. :)..

No, really this is getting crazy. I think torrenting is a great way to share a file with a friend, especially if your email box is too small to send it. The only risk with uploading your own personal stuff to the free trackers is that you have to share it with everyone. I don’t know how interesting 50 mb of family photos/video snips would be to complete strangers, but it is a great way of sharing files online. Kinda scary too!

fun website joygoround

what if u just swap hard drives?

why don you just sell your hard drive to someone else?

obvioulsly demand s of thousand s of dollars for your 18 yr old freshman mistakes would be paid by your parents and you would …move on…

Library’s whats with that huh? Anyone ever get sued over using a library? How many people check out DVD’s, Videos, Movies, Music and copy it from librarys? They get most the main stream Movies, Music you can mostly reserve online they send you a nice email saying come pick up XYZ. You get a week or more to do with it what you will.

Way I see it Bit torrent or other methods should be turned into the worlds library system

What I don’t understand is that if you don’t have a dedicated IP address..how can they prove that you downloaded anything. Unless you have a dedicated IP adress..your IP address will be different everytime you log on.

Yeah p2p is cool and all, and yeah i used napster back in the day, i even grab a few torrents here and there. Seeing as how my favorite artists are only getting about 45 cents per album i buy anyway, i really don’t care. You know, I’m not saying that it’s okay to steal from theives, but you can find good music, and actually help support the bands you like buy going indie. Consider buying music from your favorite artists directly. Check out your local scene, i’ve found great music locally and actually had people honestly thank me for buying their cd from them. It’s important that we never forget that artists do deserve the money they earn. You like the music, help them pay the rent. Musicians have bills too you know. I don’t really give a crap about the RIAA, ASCAP, BMI, SONY, INTERSCOPE, CAPITOL, and the like. The labels are theives out to make their money by screwing around with fans. Musicians don’t like it either, but once the contract is signed, they’re screwed.

In short, pay the artists, screw the labels.

oh and btw, libraries, and braodcast stations both pay ASCAP, BMI, the RIAA, and the MPAA a fee to be able to check out certain types of media. These fees are recouped through advertising (radio) and fundraisers (library). The only exception to that is academic libraries whose use of the materials usually falls under ‘fair use’. If you then go about breaking the law after you’ve checked out the materials, that’s your problem. the libraries are protected from liability on that because you signed a contract with them when you got your library card that says something along the lines of “i agree to hold harmless…the library..if i get sued…for being a dumbass…”

besides, if you’re really afraid of getting caught, quit uploading crap. drop your seeds into the torrent pool, and once there are enough seeders, take it out. there are plenty of people in foreign countries that are happy to help piracy along its merry way. Money-grubbing is so american, and generally looked down upon by the rest of the world. hence the whole ‘terrorism’ thing…

and no, foreign courts will not uphold or make any decisions based on US court’s claims. generally, when one is sued, they are sued in the US State of Incorporation of the plaintiff (if by a person and not a company, it’s where they plaintiff lives, not the defendant). There is *nothing* illegal about piracy in the US. You cannot go to jail, and there are no civil penalties in place. It is only illegal if you are infringing on someone’s copyright (ie, distribution though and electronic medium violates the mechanical copyright statutes, hence DL is fine but UL is actionable). Non americans cannot be sued in american courts, because it is unconstitutional. That’s why thepiratebay can do anything it wants, because sweden has no laws regarding mechanical copyrights. Canadians can be sued by canadian companies in canadian courts, but no court in its right mind would help to uphold the civil laws of a foreign entity against its own citizens (criminal is different, and criminals can be extradited, but the RIAA does’t have enough money to go through a series of extradition hearings).

so yeah, if you think you have a real problem, quit uploading crap. There are plenty of people who don’t have any problem with it, so start being a leech and quit being a martyr, because nobody cares if you’re a martyr for P2P. I mean, seriously. And you can always call your ISP and ask them to change your IP address. It’s an easy thing to do, takes about 3 minutes, and is pretty good protection against IP based attackers.

A civil suit is bullshit, they want money for a perceived wrongdoing on your part. Never admit that wrongdoing, because they have to *prove* that it was *you* personally. do not *ever* respond to a C&D letter, and ***NEVER*** answer to ***ANYONE*** who calls you out by your full name. If they can’t identify you, they can’t serve you papers. Seriously, if you *are* going to break the law, don’t be stupid. And if you didn’t break the law, you should take it to court and prove it. People can’t just bill you without providing some reason as to why, and courts will always rule in the plaintiffs favor if the defendant doesn’t at least show up to defend himself (or herself).

No, if you get subpeonaed over an RIAA suit, get a lawyer, a new IP address, a new handle, and get the hell off the P2P network you were on.

oh, and turn off your uploads. possession is not illegal, distribution is.

People have made comments re: “reasonable doubt” and think that because the RIAA cannot now prove who downloaded “beyond a reasonable doubt”, that RIAA will stop filing these cases. It will lower the number filed, but not stop them.

One reason RIAA has been pursuing civil suits as opposed to having the FBI indict for criminal prosecution, is that Civil Suits DON’T have a “beyond a reasonable doubt” requirement.

All that’s generally needed in a civil suit is a “preponderance of evidence”. A much looser requirement.

That’s one reason why OJ was found not guilty in the criminal trial, but still found to be and held “responsible for” the deaths in the civil trial.

So, the RIAA will likely continue filing civil suits, hoping that a “preponderance” of the evidence will be enough in selected cases.

This subject… why is it this subject everybody just LOVES to sound like they know what they’re talking about? So many of the idiotic arguments I hear just would never hold up in an actual court of law. Say what you want about how unfair the RIAA is, but hire a good lawyer when they come calling you. The things you and your buddies think up when you’re drunk aren’t going to persuade a judge.

Is everyone forgetting about possession?

Sure they could never prove that you actually downloaded something without having hidden cameras installed or something, but the point everyone is missing is that you are in possession of the mp3’s. If all else fails they will charge you with possession.
Same goes for kiddie porn, same goes for drugs. If you are found to be in possession of illegal items, you can be charged.

I like the guy that wrote “if someone steals your car and runs down a pedestrian, how can that be blamed on you?”
Well if you’re found with the pedestrians body in your house, then I’m pretty sure you’re in trouble.

Wrong Frank, possessing mp3’s is not illegal. You can’t compare digital music to drugs. But on the other hand, you don’t have to upload the file to get sued, downloading is illegal too.

if they get a court order, they can come to your house and seize the household’s pcs before you even know they were on to you. then they will have irrefutable evidence for their case..

Guess what! There is a recent bill that has been passed (I am not sure of the exact legislation) But it states that YOU are responsible for your wireless network, and YOU are in charge of securing it. If you don’t then it is YOUR fault, and you will be sued.

Can you point to such legislation? Was it federal? State? Since no one else seems to have heard of it, might help if you had some proof.

This law is stupid & US Congress was stupid enough to support these cocksuckers

Fuck the RIAA & the people who support them!

Just change your MAC while downloading. linux is great for this just install macchanger and have fun. or on windows you can start using torrents install uTorrent and do your homework on installing ipfilter.dat into uTorrent.